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US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
#736349 04/27/20 02:55 PM
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April 27, 2020

Dear members,

As a number of states and local jurisdictions begin planning for a phased return to normalcy, US Club Soccer has targeted May 18th as the date we hope to return decision-making authority to our local leagues. This is subject to change, of course, but it is our hope that our members can begin to sensibly return to the fields after that, subject to some requirements and recommendations.

The return-to-play decision is a complicated one. We understand just how important it is for clubs, coaches, parents and players to play organized soccer again. But, as parts of the country begin to open up over the coming weeks, we encourage everyone to exercise extreme caution and continue to abide by public health experts' guidelines for hygiene, physical distancing, facemask use, etc. You can read about those guidelines on the CDC web page.

When play does resume in your area, we'll require compliance with safety measures that adhere to the CDC and federal and local governments. We will share a comprehensive list before returning to play.

The federal guidelines for states to resume business activities are outlined on the federal "Opening America" web page. In this phased approach, "schools and organized youth activities" – including sporting venues – are listed in the second phase, which is applicable for states and regions with no evidence of a rebound and that satisfy all establishing criteria.

We're hopeful that the continued suspension of activities until May 18th puts us in a position to begin Phase 2. We will continue to monitor the situation and follow up the week prior with a return-to-play decision.

IWe know how difficult this time is for everyone, and we urge everyone to remain resolute in taking the proper precautions, so that the progress we have collectively made in this fight against coronavirus will lead us to returning to the field soon.

Stay strong and stay safe.

Sincerely,

Kevin Payne
CEO/Executive Director

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736353 04/27/20 04:09 PM
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What about GG's New York Cup?

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736358 04/27/20 06:42 PM
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what about new york club....the spring soccer season is over...if they cancel high school sports and no professional sports are playing, why would local soccer leagues happen? That makes no sense...hopefully, we see something in the fall

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Anonymous #736364 04/27/20 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
what about new york club....the spring soccer season is over...if they cancel high school sports and no professional sports are playing, why would local soccer leagues happen? That makes no sense...hopefully, we see something in the fall

I think the answer is obvious. The leagues are delaying cancelling bc if they cancel, the for profit clubs will be in a very difficult position. Legally, the clubs will likely be obligated to refund parents the amounts paid to date that are allocated to the spring season. That could cripple some of the clubs financially. Moreover, many clubs may not have the requisite funds bc they may have spent that $$ to pay trainers, which would put them in a terrible position, ethically and legally. So, delay and pray seems to be the course of action they've decided to employ. Eventually they will have to give up the ghost or the clubs will begin training and playing sometime late May/June...

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736370 04/27/20 10:36 PM
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Yeah, leagues that haven't canceled yet are just worried about the dollars and the club's charging 3-4K are glad they haven't yet - if they keep putting it off, they'll have a better chance of keeping the ridiculous fees they over charge parents.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Anonymous #736373 04/28/20 06:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
what about new york club....the spring soccer season is over...if they cancel high school sports and no professional sports are playing, why would local soccer leagues happen? That makes no sense...hopefully, we see something in the fall

I think the answer is obvious. The leagues are delaying cancelling bc if they cancel, the for profit clubs will be in a very difficult position. Legally, the clubs will likely be obligated to refund parents the amounts paid to date that are allocated to the spring season. That could cripple some of the clubs financially. Moreover, many clubs may not have the requisite funds bc they may have spent that $$ to pay trainers, which would put them in a terrible position, ethically and legally. So, delay and pray seems to be the course of action they've decided to employ. Eventually they will have to give up the ghost or the clubs will begin training and playing sometime late May/June...

Agreed. Will be very difficult for many clubs to issue any refunds. Business models just not set up that way. Money spent as it comes in, it’s why you’re incentivized via discount if you pay up front. Forcing a revenue reversal will force some clubs to shrink or shut down. I think you’ll see reduced pricing for next season, but that’s about it. Clubs will use rationale that these Zoom meetings and virtual trainings which are happening are the provided service and everyone will just need to take a hit. Or complain to exhaustion and be shown the door permanently

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736375 04/28/20 08:37 AM
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I don't get it. If you bring your car in for service and have to pay upfront and find out your car wasn't fixed but the garage/dealer needs to keep your money and give you a credit for whenever would you accept it? I don't think so, so why do allow, in the case of EDP, a multi-million dollar company to keep your money? Why let any league which is also a a multi-million dollar business keep your money? Why do you any academy, trainer, etc., keep your money? WTF am I missing?

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736377 04/28/20 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Larry Miller
I don't get it. If you bring your car in for service and have to pay upfront and find out your car wasn't fixed but the garage/dealer needs to keep your money and give you a credit for whenever would you accept it? I don't think so, so why do allow, in the case of EDP, a multi-million dollar company to keep your money? Why let any league which is also a a multi-million dollar business keep your money? Why do you any academy, trainer, etc., keep your money? WTF am I missing?

Apples to Bananas comparison. I’m talking clubs versus leagues (probably wrong thread). But if you bring you car in for service, pay and believe your good for 5,000 miles......but car craps out at 3,0000 (because of something out of the garages control, I.e bad part, you run into a pot hole, etc)......you still think you’re getting a refund? Point was, I don’t see clubs refunding families because of a lost spring season and I doubt leagues will fully reimburse dollar for dollar (or come close). That money is spent.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Anonymous #736378 04/28/20 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Larry Miller
I don't get it. If you bring your car in for service and have to pay upfront and find out your car wasn't fixed but the garage/dealer needs to keep your money and give you a credit for whenever would you accept it? I don't think so, so why do allow, in the case of EDP, a multi-million dollar company to keep your money? Why let any league which is also a a multi-million dollar business keep your money? Why do you any academy, trainer, etc., keep your money? WTF am I missing?

Apples to Bananas comparison. I’m talking clubs versus leagues (probably wrong thread). But if you bring you car in for service, pay and believe your good for 5,000 miles......but car craps out at 3,0000 (because of something out of the garages control, I.e bad part, you run into a pot hole, etc)......you still think you’re getting a refund? Point was, I don’t see clubs refunding families because of a lost spring season and I doubt leagues will fully reimburse dollar for dollar (or come close). That money is spent.

You are missing the point. I believe this thread is complaining, and rightfully so, that tournaments were paid for and are not being held. Nothing in that case was provided for the money. The same with money paid for the Spring league. Sorry, but if I were a parent who paid for a tournament and league season, or anything else soccer and did get what I paid for i WOULD get my money back. If you choose to give it away that is your prerogative. It wouldn't be mine.

One more point. You say at the end "the money is spent". That is not my problem nor your problem. The league/academy/tournament is still responsible for refunding your money for services not rendered. How they get the money to refund is their financial management problem.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736379 04/28/20 09:17 AM
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What I do not understand is why haven’t these leagues, clubs, tournaments obtain insurance for this situation. This is there business and if a season is cancelled for reasons beyond there control then this insurance would insure that their customers/consumers/families are compensated as well as these entities. This should be part of every business model. This is sending a bad sign and will leave bad feeling going forward.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736380 04/28/20 09:22 AM
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Legally, I’m pretty sure I’m correct. The amounts paid for the spring session should be refunded if a traditional training/league schedule is not performed. We paid for a service and it wasn’t provided. That’s basic contract law.

Here’s the issues, let take Met Oval as an example. I don’t know their finances, but assume they aren’t flush with cash and have been paying their trainers, and all other expenses as they come due. They probably don’t have enough cash on hand to refund everyone. If all the parents demanded their refunds, they’d have to file BK. So yeah they’re on the hook, but they can’t pay. They can offer discounts next year, but you’ll have some frustrated parents and it’s really just kicking the can down the road.

Legally, liable. Practically, unable to pay.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736381 04/28/20 09:35 AM
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I think I'm 100% accurate when I say that LIJSL, EDP & EDP call all well afford to refund your money. They are FOR PROFIT businesses. The town clubs can also afford to refund your money. Sorry, but his mentality to give these soccer organizations a free pass doesn't compute with me nor is it right. Families are not all whole and able to work at home and draw a salary at this time and looking ahead some that are may run into problems. Families all deserve to get their money back, and get it back now. That is my 2 cents.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736383 04/28/20 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Larry Miller
I think I'm 100% accurate when I say that LIJSL, EDP & EDP call all well afford to refund your money. They are FOR PROFIT businesses. The town clubs can also afford to refund your money. Sorry, but his mentality to give these soccer organizations a free pass doesn't compute with me nor is it right. Families are not all whole and able to work at home and draw a salary at this time and looking ahead some that are may run into problems. Families all deserve to get their money back, and get it back now. That is my 2 cents.

The clubs are all in a holding pattern until the leagues are officially cancelled.

If and when the leagues do cancel, the clubs that collect the referee fees as part of the registration, as opposed to putting that on the coaches to collect the ref fees from the parents throughout the season, have zero excuse to not at least refund that portion of the fees.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736385 04/28/20 09:59 AM
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I agree that money should be returned and clubs smart enough to have insurance. Reality is these people are great at taking money but bad at running business. They're basically like half of the general contractors out there. They may do good work, they make money for themselves but dealing with them as a business entity is a nightmare. Tournaments that get canceled are an easy refund. The tricky part is how to create a make good that makes sense. Ideally you would take your annual fee, divide it by the # of active weeks you actually played/trained and whatever the difference between original fee and this would be the refund. Families that choose to stay with current club should be given option to roll it over to next year's fees, which allows the club to retain the money in the immediate, the family gets the credit back and at least the club has time to create fund raising efforts or camps/clinics/programs to fill that gap. This way the club gets to say they didnt try to just keep the money, they acted in good faith and worked with parents to come up with a solution that works for both sides.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736388 04/28/20 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Larry Miller
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Larry Miller
I don't get it. If you bring your car in for service and have to pay upfront and find out your car wasn't fixed but the garage/dealer needs to keep your money and give you a credit for whenever would you accept it? I don't think so, so why do allow, in the case of EDP, a multi-million dollar company to keep your money? Why let any league which is also a a multi-million dollar business keep your money? Why do you any academy, trainer, etc., keep your money? WTF am I missing?

Apples to Bananas comparison. I’m talking clubs versus leagues (probably wrong thread). But if you bring you car in for service, pay and believe your good for 5,000 miles......but car craps out at 3,0000 (because of something out of the garages control, I.e bad part, you run into a pot hole, etc)......you still think you’re getting a refund? Point was, I don’t see clubs refunding families because of a lost spring season and I doubt leagues will fully reimburse dollar for dollar (or come close). That money is spent.

You are missing the point. I believe this thread is complaining, and rightfully so, that tournaments were paid for and are not being held. Nothing in that case was provided for the money. The same with money paid for the Spring league. Sorry, but if I were a parent who paid for a tournament and league season, or anything else soccer and did get what I paid for i WOULD get my money back. If you choose to give it away that is your prerogative. It wouldn't be mine.

One more point. You say at the end "the money is spent". That is not my problem nor your problem. The league/academy/tournament is still responsible for refunding your money for services not rendered. How they get the money to refund is their financial management problem.

Both well said, but wonder if there's any legal wording in their registration disclosure that addresses this? And if these are businesses, shouldn't they be filing for interest free loans as part of the Care Act?

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736389 04/28/20 10:14 AM
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Time will tell. Has any league or club issued refunds yet? Even partial? (obviously no one conducting a full 4+ month season with practices and games).....so with that logic, families should have already received SOMETHING by now. Please raise your hands if you’ve received your refund check yet

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Anonymous #736391 04/28/20 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Time will tell. Has any league or club issued refunds yet? Even partial? (obviously no one conducting a full 4+ month season with practices and games).....so with that logic, families should have already received SOMETHING by now. Please raise your hands if you’ve received your refund check yet

Until the leagues actually cancel, there isn't much that the clubs can do because if the games resume and run through to August, it will be the same number of games and training days that would have otherwise have occurred in the spring.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Anonymous #736394 04/28/20 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Larry Miller
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Larry Miller
I don't get it. If you bring your car in for service and have to pay upfront and find out your car wasn't fixed but the garage/dealer needs to keep your money and give you a credit for whenever would you accept it? I don't think so, so why do allow, in the case of EDP, a multi-million dollar company to keep your money? Why let any league which is also a a multi-million dollar business keep your money? Why do you any academy, trainer, etc., keep your money? WTF am I missing?

Apples to Bananas comparison. I’m talking clubs versus leagues (probably wrong thread). But if you bring you car in for service, pay and believe your good for 5,000 miles......but car craps out at 3,0000 (because of something out of the garages control, I.e bad part, you run into a pot hole, etc)......you still think you’re getting a refund? Point was, I don’t see clubs refunding families because of a lost spring season and I doubt leagues will fully reimburse dollar for dollar (or come close). That money is spent.

You are missing the point. I believe this thread is complaining, and rightfully so, that tournaments were paid for and are not being held. Nothing in that case was provided for the money. The same with money paid for the Spring league. Sorry, but if I were a parent who paid for a tournament and league season, or anything else soccer and did get what I paid for i WOULD get my money back. If you choose to give it away that is your prerogative. It wouldn't be mine.

One more point. You say at the end "the money is spent". That is not my problem nor your problem. The league/academy/tournament is still responsible for refunding your money for services not rendered. How they get the money to refund is their financial management problem.

Both well said, but wonder if there's any legal wording in their registration disclosure that addresses this? And if these are businesses, shouldn't they be filing for interest free loans as part of the Care Act?

Good luck with getting a loan under the Care Act. Unless you knew someone you got nothing. No Congressional oversight for those loans. That should not be a fall back to cover costs as it wasn't guaranteed for everyone who applied. Tournament money should be refunded, period. League fees can be credited if you have a team playing again when season starts up. If a team ages out those fees should be refunded.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Anonymous #736400 04/28/20 12:19 PM
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There is actually plenty individual clubs can do but before we get to that lets look at some basic issues.

SCHOOL FIELD PERMITS..... All SPRING School sports have been cancelled so to assume the school districts will just allow clubs to start using their fields would be a mistake.

ROSTER SIZE/PLAYER PARTICIPATION..... Many many people are still very nervous about the spread of disease and have already stated to their coaches their child isn't playing this Spring regardless of what the leagues size and still others are stating their child wont be back in the Fall either unless there is a vaccine or cure. So having said that, a team has a roster of 15 to play 11v11 and say 5 or 6 families won't allow their child to play....What do we have ? A waste of time.

Now as far as what the individual clubs can do. They can refuse to allow their teams to participate in the interest of the kids health. Just because they opened the beaches in Jaws, it didn't mean anyone HAD TO go back in the water.

ENYYSA sent out their memo stating:

PLEASE KNOW EASTERN NEW YORK WILL NOT ALLOW ANY ORGANIZED SOCCER TO RESUME PLAY UNTIL WE ARE COMPLETELY ASSURED THAT IT IS 100 PERCENT SAFE TO PARTICIPATE IN A CONTACT SPORT.

Will anyone ever be able to say its 100% safe ???? Experts are predicting another wave of this and it being worse. No one loves this game more then I do but I love my kids way way more. There is no just reason to rush back to youth soccer as crappy as that may be to say but these ideas of playing into August are just ridiculous..... Regroup an hope for a Fall season.

It is my belief these leagues are all conducting themselves like every tournament any of us has attended, They want to get a few games in so they don't have to issue refunds and that is NOT putting children first.

Everyone is taking a hit with this situation, the leagues shouldn't be any different unfortunately

People need to calm down and THINK what's truly best. This Spring season is lost, many families have lost loved ones, it's not the end of the world if we do not have organized youth sports for one half season. We need to regroup and rethink things going forward, not take the "OMG we have to get back to games right now" mentality

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736404 04/28/20 03:01 PM
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And France has just cancelled their pro leagues stating "no games this Spring or Summer"

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736405 04/28/20 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Larry Miller
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Larry Miller
I don't get it. If you bring your car in for service and have to pay upfront and find out your car wasn't fixed but the garage/dealer needs to keep your money and give you a credit for whenever would you accept it? I don't think so, so why do allow, in the case of EDP, a multi-million dollar company to keep your money? Why let any league which is also a a multi-million dollar business keep your money? Why do you any academy, trainer, etc., keep your money? WTF am I missing?

Apples to Bananas comparison. I’m talking clubs versus leagues (probably wrong thread). But if you bring you car in for service, pay and believe your good for 5,000 miles......but car craps out at 3,0000 (because of something out of the garages control, I.e bad part, you run into a pot hole, etc)......you still think you’re getting a refund? Point was, I don’t see clubs refunding families because of a lost spring season and I doubt leagues will fully reimburse dollar for dollar (or come close). That money is spent.

You are missing the point. I believe this thread is complaining, and rightfully so, that tournaments were paid for and are not being held. Nothing in that case was provided for the money. The same with money paid for the Spring league. Sorry, but if I were a parent who paid for a tournament and league season, or anything else soccer and did get what I paid for i WOULD get my money back. If you choose to give it away that is your prerogative. It wouldn't be mine.

One more point. You say at the end "the money is spent". That is not my problem nor your problem. The league/academy/tournament is still responsible for refunding your money for services not rendered. How they get the money to refund is their financial management problem.

Simple contract law. If they don't provide a service you paid for, they are not entitled to the money. It doesn't matter they had overhead and used your payment for that Its not your problem.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Anonymous #736406 04/28/20 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Larry Miller
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Larry Miller
I don't get it. If you bring your car in for service and have to pay upfront and find out your car wasn't fixed but the garage/dealer needs to keep your money and give you a credit for whenever would you accept it? I don't think so, so why do allow, in the case of EDP, a multi-million dollar company to keep your money? Why let any league which is also a a multi-million dollar business keep your money? Why do you any academy, trainer, etc., keep your money? WTF am I missing?

Apples to Bananas comparison. I’m talking clubs versus leagues (probably wrong thread). But if you bring you car in for service, pay and believe your good for 5,000 miles......but car craps out at 3,0000 (because of something out of the garages control, I.e bad part, you run into a pot hole, etc)......you still think you’re getting a refund? Point was, I don’t see clubs refunding families because of a lost spring season and I doubt leagues will fully reimburse dollar for dollar (or come close). That money is spent.

You are missing the point. I believe this thread is complaining, and rightfully so, that tournaments were paid for and are not being held. Nothing in that case was provided for the money. The same with money paid for the Spring league. Sorry, but if I were a parent who paid for a tournament and league season, or anything else soccer and did get what I paid for i WOULD get my money back. If you choose to give it away that is your prerogative. It wouldn't be mine.

One more point. You say at the end "the money is spent". That is not my problem nor your problem. The league/academy/tournament is still responsible for refunding your money for services not rendered. How they get the money to refund is their financial management problem.

Simple contract law. If they don't provide a service you paid for, they are not entitled to the money. It doesn't matter they had overhead and used your payment for that Its not your problem.

Ok......so the refund checks should be rollin in shortly after an “official cancellation “. All clubs and families will be made 100% whole in short order by said leagues and clubs. And swallowing bleach / spraying yourself with Lysol is a viable cure that should be tested ASAP.......... or let’s ask this way; for those parents who have expressed a concern about returning because of anticipated risk, assuming they’ve been issued so form of refund? After all Child safety is their number 1 priority

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Anonymous #736426 04/29/20 02:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Time will tell. Has any league or club issued refunds yet? Even partial? (obviously no one conducting a full 4+ month season with practices and games).....so with that logic, families should have already received SOMETHING by now. Please raise your hands if you’ve received your refund check yet

YES CJSL (Cosmpolitan Jr.) has refunded every team's fee less $25 admin fee.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Larry Miller #736427 04/29/20 06:17 AM
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Sounds like a reporter from CNN.

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Re: US Club; extension of suspension until May 18
Anonymous #736432 04/29/20 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Larry Miller
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Larry Miller
I don't get it. If you bring your car in for service and have to pay upfront and find out your car wasn't fixed but the garage/dealer needs to keep your money and give you a credit for whenever would you accept it? I don't think so, so why do allow, in the case of EDP, a multi-million dollar company to keep your money? Why let any league which is also a a multi-million dollar business keep your money? Why do you any academy, trainer, etc., keep your money? WTF am I missing?

Apples to Bananas comparison. I’m talking clubs versus leagues (probably wrong thread). But if you bring you car in for service, pay and believe your good for 5,000 miles......but car craps out at 3,0000 (because of something out of the garages control, I.e bad part, you run into a pot hole, etc)......you still think you’re getting a refund? Point was, I don’t see clubs refunding families because of a lost spring season and I doubt leagues will fully reimburse dollar for dollar (or come close). That money is spent.

You are missing the point. I believe this thread is complaining, and rightfully so, that tournaments were paid for and are not being held. Nothing in that case was provided for the money. The same with money paid for the Spring league. Sorry, but if I were a parent who paid for a tournament and league season, or anything else soccer and did get what I paid for i WOULD get my money back. If you choose to give it away that is your prerogative. It wouldn't be mine.

One more point. You say at the end "the money is spent". That is not my problem nor your problem. The league/academy/tournament is still responsible for refunding your money for services not rendered. How they get the money to refund is their financial management problem.

Simple contract law. If they don't provide a service you paid for, they are not entitled to the money. It doesn't matter they had overhead and used your payment for that Its not your problem.

Ok......so the refund checks should be rollin in shortly after an “official cancellation “. All clubs and families will be made 100% whole in short order by said leagues and clubs. And swallowing bleach / spraying yourself with Lysol is a viable cure that should be tested ASAP.......... or let’s ask this way; for those parents who have expressed a concern about returning because of anticipated risk, assuming they’ve been issued so form of refund? After all Child safety is their number 1 priority

Yes if not providing the service, they must refund period per contract law. However, like a another poster said if they already spent the money, they don’t have it. What are you going to do, sue them individually in small claims court or as a team. Courts are closed and backed up. By the time you see your day in court, they will have applied it to next season, if there is a season, etc

( former) Fury is the poster child . Will they refund now that under the SUSA banner.

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