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Division I college soccer under threat
#735997 04/23/20 07:55 AM
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by Paul Kennedy @pkedit

Leaders of 18 college coaches' organizations representing so-called non-revenue or Olympic sports, including United Soccer Coaches, have sent a letter to NCAA president Mark Emmert opposing the request for emergency legislative relief from 27 of the 32 Division I conferences to reduce or waive several Division I membership requirements.

These conferences want to give their schools the flexibility to cut expenses related to running their athletic programs in response to revenue shortfalls caused by the coronavirus pandemic and economic downturn.
The waiver request that has leaders of non-revenue Division I sports the most fearful: reducing the requirement about the minimum number of sports a school must sponsor will put many non-revenue sports on the chopping block.

Division I landscape: NCAA Division I conferences are broken into two subdivisions: FBS (Football Bowl Subdivision) schools and non-FBS schools.

FBS schools play in one of the 10 conferences that have top-flight college football programs (Power 5 and Group of 5). Non-FBS schools are mostly smaller schools, some of which have football and compete in the FCS (Football Championship Subdivision)

FBS schools must field at least 16 teams, with a minimum of six men's teams and a minimum of eight women's teams. Non-FBS Division I schools must field at least 14 teams. (Division II requirements include: minimum of five men's teams and five women's teams or four men's teams and six women's teams. Division III requirements include: minimum of five men's teams and five women's teams.)

Soccer participation: Of the 32 conferences, 31 sponsor women's soccer and 24 sponsor men's soccer though not all schools in a conference have varsity soccer (more so on the men's side, where several conferences have the minimum number of members to qualify for an automatic bid in the NCAA Tournament).

In 2018-19, soccer ranked second in all Division I women's sports in terms of participation (behind only track & field) and fourth in all Division I men's sports in terms of participation (behind football, track & field and baseball).

Revenue threat: College athletics is particularly vulnerable to a drop in revenues in response to the pandemic and economic downturn.

“We’re an enterprise that is solely operated by those who choose to support us with their discretionary income," Texas athletic director Chris Del Conte told The Athletic recently. "Whether it be television, season tickets, all the people who donate money — all of those things are predicated on having events.” Already, $375 million in television revenues were lost with the cancellation of the NCAA men’s basketball tournament in March.

The big concern is that the college football season will not go forward in the fall, or be delayed until a later date -- yes, there is talk of playing in the winter and spring in 2021. "If we can’t play football this fall," Iowa State athletic director Jamie Pollard told The Athletic. "I mean it’s Ice Age time."

(Everyone agrees that college sports won't return until campuses are re-opened for students to return and resume on-site classes.)

Who are seeking waivers? The five Group of 5 conferences -- the smaller FBS conferences -- want four-year waivers, while the 22 non-FBS conferences want two-year waivers with an option to extend them to up to four years.

“A blanket waiver for relief will provide institutions the ability to make prudent and necessary decisions for the financial well-being of the institution," the commissioners of the Group of Five said in a letter to Emmert on April 10.

What's the response of the non-revenue sports? The Intercollegiate Coach Association Coalition argues slashing opportunities for students in non-revenue sports -- 141,483 student-athletes participated in 2018-19 -- is not the solution.

It noted that graduation rates and donation rates in these sports are higher than their non-athletic peers, and they generated $3.6 billion in tuition and fees to their universities, an amount nearly equal what it costs to provide opportunities to play collegiate sports.

On the waiver request, the non-revenue coaches group's position is:

"Reducing the minimum sports sponsorship requirement that would open the door to eliminating sports should not be an option. We are all in this together, and we are ready, eager, and willing to partner with the NCAA to find creative solutions for the challenges to come. America’s students have had so much taken from them. Now is not the time to cut them off from yet another critical institution that makes university life so special."

Power 5 conferences (FBS):
*ACC, *Big Ten, Big-12, *Pac-12, SEC.

Group of 5 conferences (FBS):
*American, *Conference USA, *Mid-American, Mountain West, *Sun Belt.

Non-FBS conferences:
*America East, *Atlantic Sun, *Atlantic 10, *Big East, Big Sky, *Big South, *Big West, * CAA, *Ivy League, *Horizon, *MAAC, Mid-Eastern, *Missouri Valley, *Northeast, Ohio Valley, *Patriot, *Southern, Southland, *Summit, SWAC, *WCC, *WAC.
*Sponsors men's soccer championship.
Note: All but the Mid-Eastern sponsors a women's soccer championship.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Larry Miller #735998 04/23/20 08:07 AM
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so much for title 9?

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736000 04/23/20 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
so much for title 9?

Title 9 would still be in effect. The schools would be forced to cut the men's programs along with the women's. The point of the waivers is to allow the colleges to drop below the current minimums for the overall number of sports that they must compete in to qualify for D1/D2/D3 status.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Larry Miller #736003 04/23/20 09:35 AM
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they will always get kids to plat just look at D3. Cut the scholly's before you cut the sport!

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736004 04/23/20 09:38 AM
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If the big time sports don't return with people allowed to be in the stadiums and arenas
There will be no scholarships for any other sports plain and simple. Football and men's basketball bring in 99% of the money. So if you're in this for the scholarship money better invest in your kids grades instead. Even the loss of one years revenue will affect the colleges ability to give out money for many years to come.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736005 04/23/20 10:08 AM
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[quote=Anonymous]If the big time sports don't return with people allowed to be in the stadiums and arenas
There will be no scholarships for any other sports plain and simple. Football and men's basketball bring in 99% of the money. So if you're in this for the scholarship money better invest in your kids grades instead. Even the loss of one years revenue will affect the colleges ability to give out money for many years to come

Thanks for the heads up. I'm out.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736025 04/23/20 12:36 PM
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Agreed. Besides, NOBODY should be in it for a scholarship in a non-revenue generating sport...they just ain't out there, it's a bit of a myth.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Larry Miller #736077 04/24/20 09:26 AM
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Yeah OK nobody should be in it for a scholarship? The loons on this sight paying $10k a year to in many instances sit on the bench, those parents are absolutely in it for a scholarship. The sane people have always said get a tutor, keep the grades up and there is a ton more money for academics than there is for soccer. And oh by the way, if you look at where the EM ECNL girls are playing in college you can make those same teams coming out of the LIJSL. Maybe without a scholarship offer but you can make the team none the less!

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736084 04/24/20 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Agreed. Besides, NOBODY should be in it for a scholarship in a non-revenue generating sport...they just ain't out there, it's a bit of a myth.

Friend just got $17,000 room and board from Clemson for soccer. So if your kid has drive YES there are scholarships. BTW, he did not play on a DA team.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736085 04/24/20 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Yeah OK nobody should be in it for a scholarship? The loons on this sight paying $10k a year to in many instances sit on the bench, those parents are absolutely in it for a scholarship. The sane people have always said get a tutor, keep the grades up and there is a ton more money for academics than there is for soccer. And oh by the way, if you look at where the EM & SUSA ECNL girls are playing in college you can make those same teams coming out of the LIJSL. Maybe without a scholarship offer but you can make the team none the less!

That is exactly right. The list of parents on here bragging about their kids playing in ECNL is very long. My daughter loves playing soccer but what league she played in wasn't more important than her education. Her mentality is why she will be attending a highly coveted University with more Scholarship money than any of these ECNL players will get for playing soccer.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736086 04/24/20 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Agreed. Besides, NOBODY should be in it for a scholarship in a non-revenue generating sport...they just ain't out there, it's a bit of a myth.

Friend just got $17,000 room and board from Clemson for soccer. So if your kid has drive YES there are scholarships. BTW, he did not play on a DA team.
My guess is that this is because he has really good academics too. You need both brains and ability otherwise I'd guess you won't be in the running for a scholarship. Congratulations to your friend!!

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736088 04/24/20 11:32 AM
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Okay, let me make my position clear as well as the majority of parents we know over the years playing ECNL. This was never just about getting a “full ride” for college that is the lame argument of non-ECNL parents. It was always about the level of competition and the competitiveness of the team and playing against equally competitive teams in our area and from other regions. The fact at any given ECNL College showcase approx 100 coaches from Top 20 programs, P5 Conference schools as well as everywhere else made it very exciting to see. This is all true! The truth of the matter is we knew early on which players fell into the 1% of the team who were going to get significant scholarship money. For the rest of us it was about school first and using soccer to get into a great school. For the vast majority of these ECNL players they verbally committed by the end of there Junior year! As a parent do you know what kind of relief that is knowing she was now verbally committed! ECNL Playing ECNL was what gave her the opportunity to use her school grades and test scores to be able to have that very good school be attracted to her as a student/athlete. For the vast majority of kids it’s school first and foremost. ECNL is the platform that enabled that to happen. End of story, drop the Mic!

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Larry Miller #736110 04/24/20 01:01 PM
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Congratulations on the scholarship. My thing has always been that LI ECNL girls aren't playing at North Carolina or Stanford they are playing at Fairfield and New Paltz and Adelphi...all nice schools, all with fine academics but give me a break for the people that have around $75k - $100k in soccer expenses invested in their kids since u7 - u19. Our LIJSL Champions division team is sending 3 kids to play d3 in the SUNYAC where they will wear the same kit as their LI ECNL neighbors

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736119 04/24/20 01:33 PM
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Your not listening or not comprehending what I just wrote. No one was bragging or discussing scholarships. The vast majority did not join ECNL thinking anyone was going to get significant scholarship money. Go onto the websites of the ECNL Clubs and look at the schools that these girls are attending in 2020 as well as years before. They are listed. There are girls attending all Divisions of colleges including P5 conference schools that you just said is not happening including North Carolina and Stanford. Playing ECNL enabled those players to showcase there talent in front of those caliber schools staff. I will not diminish those LIJSL young ladies playing D3 next year but wish them good luck. Go look up on the websites of the LI ECNL/DA clubs ALL the schools that these players will be student/athletes. I have never given it a second thought about all the years my daughters played ECNL. All the trips were great adventures that have helped my girls become the young women they are now. I just picked up the mic and dropped it again.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736127 04/24/20 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Congratulations on the scholarship. My thing has always been that LI ECNL girls aren't playing at North Carolina or Stanford they are playing at Fairfield and New Paltz and Adelphi...all nice schools, all with fine academics but give me a break for the people that have around $75k - $100k in soccer expenses invested in their kids since u7 - u19. Our LIJSL Champions division team is sending 3 kids to play d3 in the SUNYAC where they will wear the same kit as their LI ECNL neighbors

Weird my kid's LI ECNL team has a girl committed to Stanford...but I guess she's lying. And not for anything, Fairfield is a pretty decent school with a pretty decent soccer program whose entire recruit list for 2020 season is ECNL players-I guess your LIJSL kids weren't interested in that school, lol.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736132 04/24/20 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Your not listening or not comprehending what I just wrote. No one was bragging or discussing scholarships. The vast majority did not join ECNL thinking anyone was going to get significant scholarship money. Go onto the websites of the ECNL Clubs and look at the schools that these girls are attending in 2020 as well as years before. They are listed. There are girls attending all Divisions of colleges including P5 conference schools that you just said is not happening including North Carolina and Stanford. Playing ECNL enabled those players to showcase there talent in front of those caliber schools staff. I will not diminish those LIJSL young ladies playing D3 next year but wish them good luck. Go look up on the websites of the LI ECNL/DA clubs ALL the schools that these players will be student/athletes. I have never given it a second thought about all the years my daughters played ECNL. All the trips were great adventures that have helped my girls become the young women they are now. I just picked up the mic and dropped it again.


It's funny how ECNL parents behave when faced with the obvious. Weird my kid will be playing alongside that ECNL girl commited to Stanford and didn't need to play ECNL to do it. ECNL is not the only league that provides showcases in front of caliber schools nor is it the only place that provides trips and adventures enjoyed by families. Sorry for all the delusional parents out there. Thank you for the mic, I will drop it right here.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Larry Miller #736141 04/24/20 03:40 PM
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Here are where the college bound players have gone the last three years. Not sure if they do like lacrosse where they list your school even if you arent going to play. Any player she be applauded for playing at the next level and many of these schools are good academically however there are really any soccer powerhouses WITH great educations on the list
Manhattan College
Molloy College
Navy
SUNY Cortland
Stonybrook University
Iona College
Scranton University
Mollo College
Fairfield University
Mercy College
Scranton UniversityVillanova University
Syracuse University
University of Connecticut
Iona College
University of Vermont
University of Vermont
Loyola University Maryland
Towson University
Duquesne University
Manhattan College
Binghamton University
University of Miami
Dickinson College
Lafayette College
Columbia University
Haverford College
Muhlenbery College
Mississippi State University
Loyola University Maryland
Colby College
Babson College
MIT
LIU Post
University of Illinois
Stonehill College
LIU Post
Dickinson College
Duquesne University
George Washington University
Ithaca College
Sacred Heart University
Providence College
Molloy College
Geneseo College
Molloy College
Queens College

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Larry Miller #736148 04/24/20 05:13 PM
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College soccer is going to be long gone before the vast majority of anyone's kids here ever get a chance to play a game. What will be the next hydrant for rich suburban parents to pee on?

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Larry Miller #736154 04/24/20 06:03 PM
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So we are confirming that all of this back & forth nonsense about which club is better, my kids the best, SUSA is better than Alby is better than EM

ODP, ECNL. DA, NPL, ABC, XYZ, 1,2,3 is total BS & a money machine.

Kids go out & play anywhere you can with kids you like. Find a good Academic College that you want to go to whether it be D1,2,or 3 where you will have a chance to play, grow, & have fun. And if you are the next Messi or Alex Morgan someone will find you...

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736166 04/24/20 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Here are where the college bound players have gone the last three years. Not sure if they do like lacrosse where they list your school even if you arent going to play. Any player she be applauded for playing at the next level and many of these schools are good academically however there are really any soccer powerhouses WITH great educations on the list
Manhattan College
Molloy College
Navy
SUNY Cortland
Stonybrook University
Iona College
Scranton University
Mollo College
Fairfield University
Mercy College
Scranton UniversityVillanova University
Syracuse University
University of Connecticut
Iona College
University of Vermont
University of Vermont
Loyola University Maryland
Towson University
Duquesne University
Manhattan College
Binghamton University
University of Miami
Dickinson College
Lafayette College
Columbia University
Haverford College
Muhlenbery College
Mississippi State University
Loyola University Maryland
Colby College
Babson College
MIT
LIU Post
University of Illinois
Stonehill College
LIU Post
Dickinson College
Duquesne University
George Washington University
Ithaca College
Sacred Heart University
Providence College
Molloy College
Geneseo College
Molloy College
Queens College


What club is this list from?

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736413 04/28/20 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Agreed. Besides, NOBODY should be in it for a scholarship in a non-revenue generating sport...they just ain't out there, it's a bit of a myth.

Friend just got $17,000 room and board from Clemson for soccer. So if your kid has drive YES there are scholarships. BTW, he did not play on a DA team.

Good for him. Still has to come up with nearly $40,000 per year....or $160,000 over 4 years.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736415 04/28/20 10:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Agreed. Besides, NOBODY should be in it for a scholarship in a non-revenue generating sport...they just ain't out there, it's a bit of a myth.

Friend just got $17,000 room and board from Clemson for soccer. So if your kid has drive YES there are scholarships. BTW, he did not play on a DA team.

Out of state tuition for Clemson is $37,000.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736421 04/28/20 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Agreed. Besides, NOBODY should be in it for a scholarship in a non-revenue generating sport...they just ain't out there, it's a bit of a myth.

Friend just got $17,000 room and board from Clemson for soccer. So if your kid has drive YES there are scholarships. BTW, he did not play on a DA team.

Out of state tuition for Clemson is $37,000.

So then he is going to Clemson for a great experience for the price of a SUNY school. That is great! There is lots of money at out of state and private colleges for academics and soccer.

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Larry Miller #736557 05/01/20 09:58 AM
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Does anybody happen to know how to check if your future college’s soccer program is in jeopardy without bothering the coach?

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Re: Division I college soccer under threat
Anonymous #736564 05/01/20 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Does anybody happen to know how to check if your future college’s soccer program is in jeopardy without bothering the coach?

Everything is uncertain to the extent that the NCAA and college conferences are trying to figure everything out going forward in the summer if Fall sports will start on time or be delayed for 2-3 months or just moved to the Spring. These decisions will be made with universities and the medical community for the nation and the specific state. The tricky part is conferences which are in the “hot zone” and those not. Do you just have inter conference play without matches outside the conference? These are the issues that the NCAA has to decide. It’s interesting that the P5 conferences have not joined the other conferences in there action with the NCAA regarding waivers so we shall see in the upcoming weeks how this plays out.

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