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Your Thoughts and Comments....
#694266 10/21/17 06:20 PM
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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694268 10/21/17 06:43 PM
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Glorified short term(10 year) licensing deal with very questionable partners, very different than what is told to us. I cant believe they even put this in bold - FC Barcelona exempt from any kind of economic investment. Seriously?

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Anonymous #694269 10/21/17 06:56 PM
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Where does that leave LI /KP Barcelona??

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694272 10/21/17 07:38 PM
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Many called it like this..... It will be amusing to see how all the pro Barca parents try to spin this. Prospect paid for a name and the fools came running with their checkbooks.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694273 10/21/17 07:42 PM
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Here is the full text of the announcement. If you have seen the presentation during the tryouts, and compare that to this announcement, does it make you wonder if some scam artists are involved here? And once again, Larry is correct!

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Barça Academy for the United States

The members have approved with 283 votes in favour, 21 blank and 25 against, the project that will allow a new Barça Academy in New York. As such, the expansion of FC Barcelona in the United States takes another step forward after the opening of an office in the same city in September 2016.

The Academy will be situated in the Tri-State Area, a region which is at the juncture of the three states of New York, New Jersey and Connecticut. During the search for land to develop the Academy, a site was found that belonged to The Anthony J. And Vincenza R. Santilli Revocable Family Asset Company which had a rental agreement with Prospect Sports Partner LLC (PSP) for a period of 90 years for the construction and use of sporting facilities that complied perfectly with the Club’s needs.

The land is situated more precisely in King’s Park, between the counties of Suffolk and Nassau on Long Island where there is a population of around 184,000 children under the age of 14 and a secondary market of more than 2.5 million children in Tri-State Area. “We foresee some 2,000 boys and girls playing at our facilities,” confirmed Club CEO Òscar Grau in his explanation of the project.

A joint venture will be created

The business formula that this project proposes is that of a joint venture, considered the best option for the objectives that are planned for this initiative that allows FC Barcelona to develop its football academy and make use of the rest of the sporting complex that will be built at the site mentioned that will cover some 20,000 square metres.

In this space some eight football pitches with artificial turf are planned with two pitches with natural turf, as well as all the facilities needed for the playing of sport, all of the highest quality. Given the climate of the area, also planned is that some of the pitches can be covered during the winter so that the Academy can carry out its work all year round. Also planned is the construction of offices, shops, parking lots and other auxiliary buildings.

FC Barcelona exempt from any kind of economic investment

All the investment in the construction of the facilities that will form part of the joint venture will come exclusively from PSP, FC Barcelona being exempt from any type of economic commitment. FC Barcelona is committed to sending a team of coaches trained by the Club in order to implement the methodology and philosophy and way of working to guarantee that our image is faithfully represented and cared for at all times.

The length of this joint business venture will be 10 years with the option of another 10. The terms of the agreement envisage an income for the Club of 15% of the income generated in the form of royalties for the use of the brand as well as 50% of the profits generated overall by the project that is developed.

The viability studies that have been carried out by the Club in conjunction with Deloitte, and under the business predictions with expected demand in mind, predict a positive return for the Club during the first 5 years.

Principal objective: to help the Barça brand grow

Despite the economic benefits foreseen for the project, the main objective is sporting and the brand. Sporting, because an elite football academy is the aim to compete at the highest level in the country as well as being a point of reference for young North American players. The brand, because this project will serve as a tool for growth in an area of strategic importance for the Club: the USA, and in particular the New York area which has a great influence locally and around the globe.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694276 10/21/17 07:56 PM
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All you need to know is printed in bold type near the bottom:

Principal objective: to help the Barça brand grow

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694279 10/21/17 08:14 PM
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Wow! I cant believe they were so blatant to put that in writing. “Hey we have nothing to do with this but thanks for your money”. Build the brand baby. Facility is still gorgeous but i dont see this venture being successful. So much for a long Island camp nou.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694281 10/21/17 08:20 PM
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From one another part of the announcement on Barca's twitter account:

The Project
Creation of an elite soccer academy to compete in the most important leagues in the country and become the leading project for American players.

- 1st Academy directly managed by Barca

Doesn't sound like a franchise deal to me if the academy is managed by Barca.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694283 10/21/17 08:41 PM
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A few observations -

* What is the group paying in land rent ? they are not buying the land so that will help with the math but it will still be difficult to generate enough cash flow to repay the costs. To just get the upfront $33 million project cost back over the life of a 90 year land lease you have to generate $366,666 per year in profits. That breakeven number per year is enourmous when you consider they have 90 years to make back their investment and that assumes no return on the investment over 90 years !
* News articles quote this as a $33 million project. To generate just a 5% return on that investment the club needs to generate a net profit of $1.5 mln after all expenses including the large 15% royalty fee that FCB will get on the deal.
* They will have to generate a lot of revenue from other soccer activities like tournaments, field rental, indoor, etc.
* They say the club will grow to 2,000 players. The site is too far east and north on LI to support a club of that size. Unless other local clubs fold in there is no way they get to those numbers.
* At 2,000 players here is some simple math. Assuming they charge $3,000 per year that is $6 million per year in revenue. Take the FBC 15% royalty off the top and that leaves $5.1 million. Assuming 70% of total revenues go to expenses (which is standard for a club that operates at the elite level and owns and operates their own real estate facility) that leaves you with $900,000 (remember the 70% expense ratio is against the $6 million revenues not the net revenue number after the 15% royalty). So based on my earlier comment about 5% return on the investment they are way short.
* This math assumes the entity is a no-profit. If the owner and operator of the complex is a taxable entity they have no chance of success (i.e. they have to pay real estate taxes on the land and taxes on their profits).
* Now their profits can be enhanced with summer camp, clinics, tournaments, etc., which is easy to put into a business plan but not easy to execute.
* One of the big questions in the math is whether the FCB coaches they are sending will train free of charge (i.e. FCB compensates their coaches through the 15% royalty) or will the local club operator have to pay salaries on a current basis. If there are no trainer fees and FCB pays out of the royalty, that would make a big difference in the match. If the club has to pay 15% royalty and has to pay coach fees, the deal is flawed for the local partners.
* Factor in the long term costs of maintaining and upgrading the facility in the later years when things start to break and that starts to absorb future profits

Overall, I think the price they have to charge families to join combined with the "B" location (if this was in Nassau County which offers a stronger population center with higher disposable income it could be an A location) will make this a tough business plan to execute. Running a club with +2,000 kids is not easy to create and is even more difficult to maintain. Keep this in mind, FCB liked the business plan so much they went out of their way to say they are not investing a nickel into the business but are happy to take 15% of gross revenues as a royalty. This piece of the deal tells you everything you need to know when it comes to FCB's assessment of the downside risk. They are taking reputation risk but no financial risk at all.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Anonymous #694284 10/21/17 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
From one another part of the announcement on Barca's twitter account:

The Project
Creation of an elite soccer academy to compete in the most important leagues in the country and become the leading project for American players.

- 1st Academy directly managed by Barca

Doesn't sound like a franchise deal to me if the academy is managed by Barca.




Prospect Sports propaganda police on damage control.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694287 10/21/17 09:14 PM
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PSP providing the facilities, Barca providing the people to actually run the club. And from the looks of it, some very serious money is being put into the project. Quite impressive.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694291 10/21/17 09:47 PM
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Seems like a good project except for the location. I am not sure why all the armchair business people on here are so critical. And I don't know about the B and C teams but the A teams play very attractive soccer so I assume the training is excellent.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694295 10/21/17 09:54 PM
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My thoughts....

SUSA will have a new LARGE facility in the town of Islip
Barca will have a new LARGE facility in the town of Smithtown

Both facilities will need a large dependable revenue stream to make this sucessful
Barca's facility will have retail and medical office to help their revenue stream
Time will tell who made the right decision

Some collateral damage
NY Surf.....have the coaches/trainers not the facilities

Local Club impact Smithtown, Lake Grove, Hauppaugue, Northport, HBC attrition to Barca
Smithtown breakup with East Meadow ECNL.......

Local Club impact Central Islip-Brentwood, EI, WI, Bayshore attrition to SUSA and/or Barca

Appears that the death of the local community club is being hastened

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Cross It 4 Fun #694301 10/21/17 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Cross It 4 Fun

Appears that the death of the local community club is being hastened


Actually, if two true "super powers" get created with proper facilities, they will consolidate the top talent and collapse a bunch of other smaller trainer driven clubs and the local community club will get back a lot of players they have lost over the years. The problem is right now is that there are no singular dominant clubs, at least in Suffolk, so people club hop every year.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694307 10/21/17 11:36 PM
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I wonder if it was Bart Nason,while getting his son a job at a second division Spanish team, was the go between for Keith DeLucia and Barcelona? Can I get a briefing from the Barça police?

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Anonymous #694309 10/22/17 12:16 AM
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Quite a few observations - someone send me the cliff notes.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694313 10/22/17 08:20 AM
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If you read the announcement carefully, it is clear that Barca is able to leverage its brand name, and make practically no investments in the long island facility. They are not taking any financial risks, only taking some reputational risk. As a parent, you have to wonder how committed they are to this location or academy in general. Lease is also short term, not showing lots of confidence or commitment. My guess is the Spanish coaches will "train" some local coaches in the next year or two, and will depart. At that time, it is truly a local run enterprise with significant chunk of money going to a foreign club. They may still offer pretty good training, but I don't see how this is a fully owned and operated by Barca(as they have repeatedly claimed).

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Anonymous #694315 10/22/17 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Cross It 4 Fun

Appears that the death of the local community club is being hastened


Actually, if two true "super powers" get created with proper facilities, they will consolidate the top talent and collapse a bunch of other smaller trainer driven clubs and the local community club will get back a lot of players they have lost over the years. The problem is right now is that there are no singular dominant clubs, at least in Suffolk, so people club hop every year.


One would hope the consolidation you mention would happen. It is a rational thought but here on LI That will not happen because as you point out the irrational parents are always club hopping for the next shiny thing out there.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694317 10/22/17 09:19 AM
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You are reading what is most likely a club or legally required notice to stockholders; these documents are traditionally thin on facts, just enough for club to be able to say it complied with rule or statute.

Announcement never uses the word “license”.

Announcement never discusses ownership structure of entity, but described deal as a “joint-venture”, which usually means two or more parties each bring something to a deal and in return receive an ownership stake in the JV entity.

Barca is bringing coaches. Length of time is not referenced, but assume is all 10 years, based on “at all times” language in notice, as well as if their obligation was anything less than that, they would mention it as another “coup”, similar to highlighting no economic investment point (which also bears closer scrutiny).

PSP is bringing the facility. The economic investment point is made by Barca in notice with respect to building the facility, nothing else. I don’t know if Barca does have any economic obligations, but assume they do based on notice.

I can’t get to “wholly-owned” by Barca with above analysis, but one or two unlikely scenarios does get them there, they own the JV outright in exchange for which the PSP party has received long term contacts for their services, or, JV is jointly owned now but if academy is succesful, Barca could have a right to buy out PSP parties.

My two cents.

If I were a Barca parent I would be heartened by the news that some sort of shareholder vote was taken for deal (is a more serious transaction, needing approval of more than the “business” people at club), and this confirms that Barca coaches will be here, long term (to me until proven otherwise). I would have questions about wholly-owned issue, but in my Sunday morning haze, I may be attributing something I read in a newspaper to Barca. If presentations included that statement, would be asking for an explanation.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Anonymous #694319 10/22/17 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
From one another part of the announcement on Barca's twitter account:

The Project
Creation of an elite soccer academy to compete in the most important leagues in the country and become the leading project for American players.

- 1st Academy directly managed by Barca

Doesn't sound like a franchise deal to me if the academy is managed by Barca.


It appears some need to reread the press announcement. They flat out say they have no financial investment in the project. Their mission statement (last paragraph) literally says their objective is to build the brand. Pure licensing deal.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694323 10/22/17 10:52 AM
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Is it free ??? What is the bottom line dollar for membership ? Are they playing DA for girls / boys ? What leagues - Ecnl ? Npl? Will be interesting with a new Competitor in the market !

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Anonymous #694325 10/22/17 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Originally Posted by Anonymous
From one another part of the announcement on Barca's twitter account:

The Project
Creation of an elite soccer academy to compete in the most important leagues in the country and become the leading project for American players.

- 1st Academy directly managed by Barca

Doesn't sound like a franchise deal to me if the academy is managed by Barca.


It appears some need to reread the press announcement. They flat out say they have no financial investment in the project. Their mission statement (last paragraph) literally says their objective is to build the brand. Pure licensing deal.


No, it doesn’t; reread it, and try to be objective, to quote:

“FC Barcelona exempt from any kind of economic investment

All the investment in the construction of the facilities that will form part of the joint venture will come exclusively from PSP, FC Barcelona being exempt from any type of economic commitment.”

That statement relates only to the facility, nothing else. If you are doing a deal with one of the most well known teams in the world, they don’t need you for football, hey have that covered; they need you for the physical plant.

You also conveniently forget the reference to the sporting commitment from “mission statement”, to quote:

“Despite the economic benefits foreseen for the project, the main objective is sporting and the brand. Sporting, because an elite football academy is the aim to compete at the highest level in the country as well as being a point of reference for young North American players.”

I would note that they referenced “sporting” first.

I am not interested in getting into a flame war, the anti-Barca people will be out in force to discredit Barca with whatever they can hang their hat on; I am just suggesting that there is a positive way to read this as well.

The bottom line is Barca is a business, it needs to make money to survive, like your plumber or your lawyer; this appears to be a cheap way for them to break into tri-state area and possibly make some money without to much economic risk, provided the brand is protected.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694327 10/22/17 12:06 PM
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Let me give you some background info how Barça NY got themselves in this pickle. The Kings Park facility hit a snag with the Smithtown review board. Prospect Sports thought they were going to walk into those meeting and convince the review board that they were the real Barcelona FC the same way they pitched Long Island parents. Unfortunately for Barça NY somebody from Smithtown called Bullsh*t. Smithtown review said you need to produce some type of credentials and/or Bona fides backing that you are who you say you are. As you can guess Barça NY scrambled to get something together and produced a quick presentation for the FCB board and got on the next month’s meeting agenda. Nothing out of the ordinary, similar to a domestic company needing a lease to get a contract. Now Barça NY thought they were sitting pretty, they though they were going to get the letter that they needed for Smithtown but they got blindsided by this press release, they never expected FCB to lay it all out there as such. Once it was presented to the FCB Board, legal got involved in drawing up the document for Prospect Sports. They made sure to define exactly what the deal was and their indemnification. What started out as getting a simple letter to the Smithtown board for their petition turned into the entire industry seeing their hand. Now we need to see what Barça NY shows Smithtown because they now have the proven pedigree of speaking in half truths, or as I like to call them, Bullsh*t Artists. Bravo Smithtown.

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Larry Miller #694328 10/22/17 12:11 PM
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Regardless of any statements, just about everyone will pay a fee to be at try outs. If my son and daughter want to try out, I will be bring them too. See you there!

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Re: Your Thoughts and Comments....
Anonymous #694329 10/22/17 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Anonymous
Now we need to see what Barça NY shows Smithtown because they now have the proven pedigree of speaking in half truths, or as I like to call them, Bullsh*t Artists. Bravo Smithtown.


Please list the half-truths or BS that you are referring to. This is not a licensing or franchise deal. The soccer academy will be run by FC Barcelona with trainers from the club. The facility was always going to be run by Prospect Sports. Now we know why it may be behind schedule.

As a Barca parent, the quality of training has exceeded my expectations. Training sessions typically include diverse and challenging drills. My son who played DA last year and thought he has seen every drill imaginable sees something new every session. Forca Barca.

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