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#474644 - 05/11/12 09:45 AM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: Anonymous]
jamie_soccer Offline
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Registered: 07/28/08
Posts: 146
hi, i know it's been discussed here before and i tried searching for the topic but failed so i have to ask again. ivy league college recruiting process, my kid had a chance to speak to the coach and was told that ivy league colleges does not offer soccer scholarships only financial aide. the coach expressed interest but then question is what is the benefit of playing soccer on this colleges if there is no scholarship. am i getting it wrong? how is the ivy league recruiting process different from other division 1 colleges?

thanks.. any info will be greatly appreciated.

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#474653 - 05/11/12 10:05 AM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: BoardLord]
jamie_soccer Offline
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Registered: 07/28/08
Posts: 146
Originally Posted By: BoardLord
Originally Posted By: Anonymous
How does recruiting work for Ivy League school? Because I know they do not give "athletic" scholarships. Does this money get packaged under a different name? What monies can you expect to get from these schools, and what is the exact meaning of "Ivy League schools cover 100% of financial need."?
Ivy League schools, given the academic criteria needed for admission, will afford their coaches a limited number of golden tickets for athletes. In these cases, the admission requirements might be slightly (although not extensively) softened given a special talent that the player might have. At Yale University for example, approximately 250 slots of each admitted class are allocated for athletes with a large percentage of those being "golden ticket" recruits. In the case of men's and women's soccer, there are four golden tickets available for each.

In terms of meeting 100% of demonstrated need, universities will use this terminology to describe aid, grants, and loans to pay the full bills. Remember that meeting 100% of demonstrated need implies that a funding plan will be in place to pay the tuition and housing bills - even if there is a loan element in the equation.


what is a "golden ticket"? thanks.

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#474744 - 05/11/12 03:59 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: jamie_soccer]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: jamie_soccer
Originally Posted By: BoardLord
Originally Posted By: Anonymous
How does recruiting work for Ivy League school? Because I know they do not give "athletic" scholarships. Does this money get packaged under a different name? What monies can you expect to get from these schools, and what is the exact meaning of "Ivy League schools cover 100% of financial need."?
Ivy League schools, given the academic criteria needed for admission, will afford their coaches a limited number of golden tickets for athletes. In these cases, the admission requirements might be slightly (although not extensively) softened given a special talent that the player might have. At Yale University for example, approximately 250 slots of each admitted class are allocated for athletes with a large percentage of those being "golden ticket" recruits. In the case of men's and women's soccer, there are four golden tickets available for each.

In terms of meeting 100% of demonstrated need, universities will use this terminology to describe aid, grants, and loans to pay the full bills. Remember that meeting 100% of demonstrated need implies that a funding plan will be in place to pay the tuition and housing bills - even if there is a loan element in the equation.


what is a "golden ticket"? thanks.


A "golden ticket", also known as a coaches tip is an advantage in the admissions process. Depending on the school and the interest in the player it can range from an outright this person gets in to a little bit of a tie breaker.

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#474745 - 05/11/12 04:01 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: jamie_soccer]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: jamie_soccer
hi, i know it's been discussed here before and i tried searching for the topic but failed so i have to ask again. ivy league college recruiting process, my kid had a chance to speak to the coach and was told that ivy league colleges does not offer soccer scholarships only financial aide. the coach expressed interest but then question is what is the benefit of playing soccer on this colleges if there is no scholarship. am i getting it wrong? how is the ivy league recruiting process different from other division 1 colleges?

thanks.. any info will be greatly appreciated.


Advantage as compared to what?

He gets an ivy league education and a chance to continue to play the sport he loves.

Ivy leagues tend to be the most generous with need based aid. If your situation is right, the cost to attend an ivy might be lower than an lower tier school.

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#474901 - 05/12/12 03:22 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: Anonymous]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: Anonymous
Originally Posted By: jamie_soccer
hi, i know it's been discussed here before and i tried searching for the topic but failed so i have to ask again. ivy league college recruiting process, my kid had a chance to speak to the coach and was told that ivy league colleges does not offer soccer scholarships only financial aide. the coach expressed interest but then question is what is the benefit of playing soccer on this colleges if there is no scholarship. am i getting it wrong? how is the ivy league recruiting process different from other division 1 colleges?

thanks.. any info will be greatly appreciated.


Advantage as compared to what?

He gets an ivy league education and a chance to continue to play the sport he loves.

Ivy leagues tend to be the most generous with need based aid. If your situation is right, the cost to attend an ivy might be lower than an lower tier school.


question actually is, what is the point of playing soccer in this college if you are not getting any benefit from it financially. if it is all based on financial aide then my kid might as well concentrate on the studies full time. i know playing college soccer eats a lot of your time on training, travel and games. i've been there.

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#475077 - 05/13/12 12:35 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: jamie_soccer]
BoardLord Offline
Back of THE NET
*****

Registered: 02/11/05
Posts: 2642
Loc: Not Possum Gulch, Arizona
Originally Posted By: jamie_soccer
hi, i know it's been discussed here before and i tried searching for the topic but failed so i have to ask again. ivy league college recruiting process, my kid had a chance to speak to the coach and was told that ivy league colleges does not offer soccer scholarships only financial aide. the coach expressed interest but then question is what is the benefit of playing soccer on this colleges if there is no scholarship. am i getting it wrong? how is the ivy league recruiting process different from other division 1 colleges?

thanks.. any info will be greatly appreciated.
First and foremost, select your college based on academic fit for your student-athlete. You can expect that 50% of student-athletes that start an NCAA athletic career in soccer will not go the distance to their senior year. Hence, being in a situation with an academic and financial fit is important.

You are correct that Ivy League schools do not offer scholarships but a seriously interested collegiate coach can help walk your application through the acceptance process. These "golden tickets" allow a coach to bring a student to an Ivy League campus with slightly less than top credentials.

The Ivy League recruiting process is different from most Division I programs as it is more like a Division III process. Basically, the lock-ins tend to take place later in junior year or even senior year on occasion once all academic records are made available. Since there are no recruitment dollars to allocate among players, the decision period for a recruiting class can be extended.

Remember, without scholarship money and with a limited number of "golden tickets", an Ivy League coach will still have a challenge to bring in sufficient numbers of freshman players. Hence, you will rarely hear an Ivy League coach turn away an academically qualified student. This might mean that there are 12-15 High School senior year students who are guaranteed spots if they are accepted to the Ivy League institution. With an acceptance rate of less than 10% and a yield in excess of 70%, that coach might be able to pull one or two additional players on average.

As a concrete example, Yale University maintains roughly four "golden tickets" and will have a group of about 8-10 students beyond that who are NOT guaranteed admission. In this way, the Ivy League coach rarely needs to say "no" to a player.

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#475079 - 05/13/12 12:45 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: Anonymous]
BoardLord Offline
Back of THE NET
*****

Registered: 02/11/05
Posts: 2642
Loc: Not Possum Gulch, Arizona
Originally Posted By: Anonymous
A "golden ticket", also known as a coaches tip is an advantage in the admissions process. Depending on the school and the interest in the player it can range from an outright this person gets in to a little bit of a tie breaker.
In the case of the Ivy League schools, "golden tickets" will virtually guarantee admission. Note that the coach is told by the admissions office to not present any candidates unless they are athletically superior and "close" to the admission criteria for the institution. Rarely will a "golden ticket" be rejected since the preadmissions process will tend to clear a potential recruit early.

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#475081 - 05/13/12 12:50 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: Anonymous]
BoardLord Offline
Back of THE NET
*****

Registered: 02/11/05
Posts: 2642
Loc: Not Possum Gulch, Arizona
Originally Posted By: Anonymous
question actually is, what is the point of playing soccer in this college if you are not getting any benefit from it financially. if it is all based on financial aide then my kid might as well concentrate on the studies full time. i know playing college soccer eats a lot of your time on training, travel and games. i've been there.
If athletic scholarships were the only reason to play a sport, the entire NCAA Division III system would not exist. There are many reasons to continue to play even within a Division III system.

Remember that there are Division I teams which do not have fully funded programs and many of those student-athletes (Patriot League in particular) play for a great academic and athletic experience.

You are correct, dear poster, that your Division I Scholarship comes with a huge "cost" and built-in expectations. Your collegiate experience will be different from many other freshmen. That becomes evident from the start when the Division I freshman student-athletes head to campus during the first week of August when most of the college campus is still dormant.

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#475102 - 05/13/12 03:24 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: Anonymous]
Powderfinger Online   sleepy
Back of THE NET

Registered: 02/13/08
Posts: 258
Originally Posted By: Anonymous

question actually is, what is the point of playing soccer in this college if you are not getting any benefit from it financially. if it is all based on financial aide then my kid might as well concentrate on the studies full time. i know playing college soccer eats a lot of your time on training, travel and games. i've been there.


Also, from my POV the advantage (besides financial) is my kid began freshman year with a social group already in place which is one of the biggest stressors to incoming freshman. She had weekly grade checks to she did not ever have a chance to fall behind academically, which as a parent I really appreciated. There are benefits beyond financial to being part of a team. Just my two cents.

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#475124 - 05/13/12 06:11 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: Anonymous]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: Anonymous
Originally Posted By: Anonymous
Originally Posted By: jamie_soccer
hi, i know it's been discussed here before and i tried searching for the topic but failed so i have to ask again. ivy league college recruiting process, my kid had a chance to speak to the coach and was told that ivy league colleges does not offer soccer scholarships only financial aide. the coach expressed interest but then question is what is the benefit of playing soccer on this colleges if there is no scholarship. am i getting it wrong? how is the ivy league recruiting process different from other division 1 colleges?

thanks.. any info will be greatly appreciated.


Advantage as compared to what?

He gets an ivy league education and a chance to continue to play the sport he loves.

Ivy leagues tend to be the most generous with need based aid. If your situation is right, the cost to attend an ivy might be lower than an lower tier school.


question actually is, what is the point of playing soccer in this college if you are not getting any benefit from it financially. if it is all based on financial aide then my kid might as well concentrate on the studies full time. i know playing college soccer eats a lot of your time on training, travel and games. i've been there.


Also, it has been shown that college athletes (particularly females, and also men in non-revenue sports), tend to have a higher GPA than the average student population.

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#475145 - 05/13/12 07:52 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: BoardLord]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: BoardLord
Originally Posted By: jamie_soccer
hi, i know it's been discussed here before and i tried searching for the topic but failed so i have to ask again. ivy league college recruiting process, my kid had a chance to speak to the coach and was told that ivy league colleges does not offer soccer scholarships only financial aide. the coach expressed interest but then question is what is the benefit of playing soccer on this colleges if there is no scholarship. am i getting it wrong? how is the ivy league recruiting process different from other division 1 colleges?

thanks.. any info will be greatly appreciated.
First and foremost, select your college based on academic fit for your student-athlete. You can expect that 50% of student-athletes that start an NCAA athletic career in soccer will not go the distance to their senior year. Hence, being in a situation with an academic and financial fit is important.

You are correct that Ivy League schools do not offer scholarships but a seriously interested collegiate coach can help walk your application through the acceptance process. These "golden tickets" allow a coach to bring a student to an Ivy League campus with slightly less than top credentials.

The Ivy League recruiting process is different from most Division I programs as it is more like a Division III process. Basically, the lock-ins tend to take place later in junior year or even senior year on occasion once all academic records are made available. Since there are no recruitment dollars to allocate among players, the decision period for a recruiting class can be extended.

Remember, without scholarship money and with a limited number of "golden tickets", an Ivy League coach will still have a challenge to bring in sufficient numbers of freshman players. Hence, you will rarely hear an Ivy League coach turn away an academically qualified student. This might mean that there are 12-15 High School senior year students who are guaranteed spots if they are accepted to the Ivy League institution. With an acceptance rate of less than 10% and a yield in excess of 70%, that coach might be able to pull one or two additional players on average.

As a concrete example, Yale University maintains roughly four "golden tickets" and will have a group of about 8-10 students beyond that who are NOT guaranteed admission. In this way, the Ivy League coach rarely needs to say "no" to a player.


thank you for the response, this helps a lot in our understanding of the ivy league recruiting process. our approach in the college selection is based on the course my kid wants to take, then we shortlist the 10 colleges (the GPA requirement considered) in that field within 6 hour drive from where we live and third is playing soccer (kid wants to play D1). with that approach our choices landed most ivy league schools. my kid was involved in one showcase where in that event had the chance to talk to the coach of one of the schools on our list. that is when it was explained to my kid that ivy league colleges does not hand out academic or athletic scholarship only financial aides. we received an email from the coach, saying that due to my kid's year (sophomore) as per ncaa regulation they won't be able to initiate a recruiting process until july 1 of the junior year. however the coach noted that we should not take it a lack of interest and it is mainly because of the ncaa regulation that recruiting can not take place. now we are not a rich family so academic or athletic money would really come in handy. that is why i posted on this board as i know there is always good information here from parents who have been into this process before.

thank you for the responses. we really appreciate this.

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#475152 - 05/13/12 08:02 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: BoardLord]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: BoardLord
Originally Posted By: jamie_soccer
hi, i know it's been discussed here before and i tried searching for the topic but failed so i have to ask again. ivy league college recruiting process, my kid had a chance to speak to the coach and was told that ivy league colleges does not offer soccer scholarships only financial aide. the coach expressed interest but then question is what is the benefit of playing soccer on this colleges if there is no scholarship. am i getting it wrong? how is the ivy league recruiting process different from other division 1 colleges?

thanks.. any info will be greatly appreciated.
First and foremost, select your college based on academic fit for your student-athlete. You can expect that 50% of student-athletes that start an NCAA athletic career in soccer will not go the distance to their senior year. Hence, being in a situation with an academic and financial fit is important.

You are correct that Ivy League schools do not offer scholarships but a seriously interested collegiate coach can help walk your application through the acceptance process. These "golden tickets" allow a coach to bring a student to an Ivy League campus with slightly less than top credentials.

The Ivy League recruiting process is different from most Division I programs as it is more like a Division III process. Basically, the lock-ins tend to take place later in junior year or even senior year on occasion once all academic records are made available. Since there are no recruitment dollars to allocate among players, the decision period for a recruiting class can be extended.

Remember, without scholarship money and with a limited number of "golden tickets", an Ivy League coach will still have a challenge to bring in sufficient numbers of freshman players. Hence, you will rarely hear an Ivy League coach turn away an academically qualified student. This might mean that there are 12-15 High School senior year students who are guaranteed spots if they are accepted to the Ivy League institution. With an acceptance rate of less than 10% and a yield in excess of 70%, that coach might be able to pull one or two additional players on average.

As a concrete example, Yale University maintains roughly four "golden tickets" and will have a group of about 8-10 students beyond that who are NOT guaranteed admission. In this way, the Ivy League coach rarely needs to say "no" to a player.


BoardLord, are you saying that there is no financial benefit in playing for ivy league colleges? we are not a rich family and will mainly rely on financial aide, academic or soccer scholarship if any. my kid is in the honors program of a high school in LI that has a very good academic reputation and the GPA is in the middle 90
's. i am asking these questions because based on our selection approach most of the collages in our top 10 list are ivy league schools. if that is the case we might focus our applications more on schools the rest of the schools in our list that are not ivy league. your input is very helpful and very much appreciated.

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#475163 - 05/13/12 08:57 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: Anonymous]
BoardLord Offline
Back of THE NET
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Registered: 02/11/05
Posts: 2642
Loc: Not Possum Gulch, Arizona
Originally Posted By: Anonymous
BoardLord, are you saying that there is no financial benefit in playing for ivy league colleges?
Let's be clear about one thing. Reread what I wrote earlier. The acceptance rate at the Ivy Leagues is now below 10% of the applicant pool. Yale and Harvard are now reported to be in the 7% range for the most recent Class of 2016. Now, this 7% includes legacy, all preadmitted athletes, overseas applicants - and the classic US-based student. Worrying about financial aid as the first concern has the cart before the horse in a very big way. Repeating, there are no athletic scholarships to be had; everything is need based. Back to your question, if your family would only consider Ivy League soccer for the athletic money, your priorities are completely misplaced in looking at Ivy League schools.

Originally Posted By: Anonymous
we are not a rich family and will mainly rely on financial aide, academic or soccer scholarship if any.
If you family is blessed with an acceptance, the endowments at these institutions will allow for greater financial generosity than most of the so-called New Ivies or Top 30 institutions nationwide. There is a reason that HYPS (Harvard-Yale-Princeton-Stanford) stand clear of all others in grant availability - endowments in excess of $20 Billion Dollars ... each.

Originally Posted By: Anonymous
my kid is in the honors program of a high school in LI that has a very good academic reputation and the GPA is in the middle 90's.
Valedictorians, salutatorians, perfect board scores, class presidents with a dozen leadership roles, AP Scholars, and more are all rejected and waitlisted at the Ivy Leagues each and every year.

New York, one of the most heavily represented states, and Long Island, the region with heaviest representation from across New York, are among the homes most heavily represented in the applicant pool. When looking for a diverse class in terms of skills, interests, and locations, New York is one of the hardest and most competitive states from which to be accepted.

In short, middle-90s is not enough. Nowhere near enough. Neither is a middle-90s with soccer. Nor with a "good high school".

Originally Posted By: Anonymous
i am asking these questions because based on our selection approach most of the collages in our top 10 list are ivy league schools. if that is the case we might focus our applications more on schools the rest of the schools in our list that are not ivy league. your input is very helpful and very much appreciated.
If you want to apply to the Ivy League schools, that is fine. Recognize that these are all fine schools however your time in researching institutions will be better spent on schools in the Top 50 if your child is so inclined. The likelihood of making the Ivy grade is sufficiently small that knowing how to decide amongst the others will be the real challenge.

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#475173 - 05/13/12 09:17 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: BoardLord]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: BoardLord
Originally Posted By: Anonymous
BoardLord, are you saying that there is no financial benefit in playing for ivy league colleges?
Let's be clear about one thing. Reread what I wrote earlier. The acceptance rate at the Ivy Leagues is now below 10% of the applicant pool. Yale and Harvard are now reported to be in the 7% range for the most recent Class of 2016. Now, this 7% includes legacy, all preadmitted athletes, overseas applicants - and the classic US-based student. Worrying about financial aid as the first concern has the cart before the horse in a very big way. Repeating, there are no athletic scholarships to be had; everything is need based. Back to your question, if your family would only consider Ivy League soccer for the athletic money, your priorities are completely misplaced in looking at Ivy League schools.

Originally Posted By: Anonymous
we are not a rich family and will mainly rely on financial aide, academic or soccer scholarship if any.
If you family is blessed with an acceptance, the endowments at these institutions will allow for greater financial generosity than most of the so-called New Ivies or Top 30 institutions nationwide. There is a reason that HYPS (Harvard-Yale-Princeton-Stanford) stand clear of all others in grant availability - endowments in excess of $20 Billion Dollars ... each.

Originally Posted By: Anonymous
my kid is in the honors program of a high school in LI that has a very good academic reputation and the GPA is in the middle 90's.
Valedictorians, salutatorians, perfect board scores, class presidents with a dozen leadership roles, AP Scholars, and more are all rejected and waitlisted at the Ivy Leagues each and every year.

New York, one of the most heavily represented states, and Long Island, the region with heaviest representation from across New York, are among the homes most heavily represented in the applicant pool. When looking for a diverse class in terms of skills, interests, and locations, New York is one of the hardest and most competitive states from which to be accepted.

In short, middle-90s is not enough. Nowhere near enough. Neither is a middle-90s with soccer. Nor with a "good high school".

Originally Posted By: Anonymous
i am asking these questions because based on our selection approach most of the collages in our top 10 list are ivy league schools. if that is the case we might focus our applications more on schools the rest of the schools in our list that are not ivy league. your input is very helpful and very much appreciated.
If you want to apply to the Ivy League schools, that is fine. Recognize that these are all fine schools however your time in researching institutions will be better spent on schools in the Top 50 if your child is so inclined. The likelihood of making the Ivy grade is sufficiently small that knowing how to decide amongst the others will be the real challenge.




BoardLord, thank you for your response. this put our selection process in a new perspective. my kid received a follow-up email from one of the ivy league colleges coach, indicating interest after talking to him in person (discussing interest, my kid's background including gpa's) and watching my kid play in a showcase. but because of my kid's graduation year, ncaa regulations does not allow them initiate recruiting process. they asked my kid to get into their online questionaire to complete so that my kid can be added to their recruiting list. we will continue to pursue this prospect and just see how it would work out but will take your advice and widen our selection process. my kid has one more year to kick the gpa and work on SAT to get to what these top colleges requires.

thank you.

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#476867 - 05/21/12 08:13 PM Re: College, Coaches, Recruitment : 2011-2012 [Re: BoardLord]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Ivys will often get/give verbal commitments to late sophmores and early juniors.

It is not at all like the D3 process as the Ivys place a much bigger emphasis on winning than D3s, and, as a result do more bar lowering, than D3s

Further, the Ivys will occasionally take a very smart (slightly lesser athlete on the squad, to help his team's overall GPA, and allowing him to accept someone slightly below the minimum.


Make no mistake, Harvard want to crush Yale, and much a Ohio State wants to beat Michigan.

One thing is clear, to be considered for one of these "golden tickets" the player better be a top 2% athlete, and top 2% academic.



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